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I keep getting my rear end packed in but the story and lore of this game is so good, I keep going back in.

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I just bought the full version, its a nice rpgmaker game, something rare enough to say. You got all the right ideas in, however the saving system is really crippling the fun. One bed on level 2 with 50% chance to die that's far too rough. You cant even leave the game and autosave. The books of enlightment are far too rare to save too and worse it sometime crash when using them. I also got crashes when trying to bash a door, or just walking in the dungeon...Its impossible to enjoy the game this way although at its core its really good.

I'm sorry to hear about such broken experience! D: I have not heard before that bashing the doors or using the book of enlightenment would cause crashes. That sounds really alarming actually! Could you specify which doors caused this if it's not too much to ask? The game is buggy, that much is obvious, but I was under the impression that most of the game breaking bugs were starting to get weeded out.

As for the saving system. The first half of the game is really just roguelike survival, which is the reason saving is also very limited. I also kinda wanted to encourage starting the game over and over and trying different things, instead of trying force through the game with a single playthrough. After the first half, the game starts to give you more chances to save in both books and free save beds. Of course I can understand that the game crashing really takes away from the experience and I'm working on fixing things the best I can.

If i remember well  the crash happen when bashing a prison door near the exit leading to the big hall with that brass knight. But it will be extremely hard to replicate this bug, i think it happened when those flying monsters were too close, maybe the game triggered two encounters at same time; one crash also happened when avoiding some guard patrol, saw him turning then crash. As for the book crash it only happened once so far but then again in all my playthroughs i only found three. I never reached the other parts of the game its far too unforgiving . One missed first attack for exemple and you end up hacked and bleeding, with no means to heal yourself .

I see... The save bug and the bug with the door sound very rare, but also very deep rooted bugs. Both calling the save screen and initiating the combat sequence are RPG Maker's own engine commands. I am constantly ironing out the bugs but those sound pretty difficult ones because I haven't messed around with the core engine that much.. 

The difficulty of the game can seem harsh but there are ways around everything that seems unfair at first. Discord channel and the wiki offer good tips on the game.

Oh i did read the wikis, it still over the top...Btw found another bug, you dont trigger trotor anymore if you try to, open the door after doing a "marriage", nor the  scared nobleman anymore. And found another glitch in endless tower , the last house in darkness allow you do go off screen with plenty of glitches. I am afraid i wont be able to see much more party already crippled with infections and lack of food.

Semi related. There is a mod on the Discord server that is a rebalancing mod for the game. The reason I mention it, is it includes a debugging tool, a book of unlimited saving, when you start the game. It's possible to just install the saving book, if you like the game's current balance.
Hope this helps!

Thanks , that's certainly something i will check.

I really suck at games like these *cough*bloodbourne*cough*darksouls*cough*  and i keep dying but oh my god it's so intriguing and beautiful in a dark kinda way. I love it. I hope we'll be seeing more from you and (as soon as i have money to spare) you guys have my full support! 

Hey thanks a lot! Although I recommend checking out bloodborne and dark souls too because they are pretty big influences of the game. And yeah of course I will continue working on more Fear & Hunger!

I love this game so far, but I think until all the bugs can be ironed out there should be a save function. I got very far without saving (way into the later game) but now when I warp back into the real world I'm stuck in the dark. 

there is a save function! Its in a form of a book, the book can be obtainable randomly throughout the game or in set places.

Kill_Switch already explained the save systems, but Misanthropologis you got a fair point. The bugs definitely need ironing out and I'm working every day to get things into better shape. All of a sudden the game got a lot more players and that's why more and more never-before-heard bugs keep appearing too. I don't like the idea of constant save function though, because it would mess up the tension of the game.

Have you considered creating an "easy" or "casual" mode that allows easier saves? I'm super interested in this, but I suck at stuff like this. 

Also, do you have a steam release date, yet? 

To Ironoverload and Misanthropologist. There is a mod that gives you an unlimited save book, on the Discord server. It's also a rebalance patch, but you can install only the save-book part of it.

Hey! I saw this game on YouTube and had to buy it (even created account on itchi.io just to do it). But I have one question for the author: do you plan linux support?

unfortunately i do not believe the developer is planning linux support but maybe in the future!

(Unrelated to Linux) Do you plan on unbanning me (Gentle Chad) at any point or should I expect otherwise? I don't mind too much but given it was a lighthearted joke... 

hhahahaahha of course

No worries, I managed to run it on linux :)

RPG Maker MV does support Linux actually and I could make a Linux port, but I barely have any knowledge of the operating system and if some bugs were to appear, I would be in trouble trying to make sense of it all. But I'll consider the port for sure.

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When using bed to sleep/coin flip is a win I'm unable to save ( like actually select from the slots to save) and then in the menu I will get this error shortly after. :-(
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Looks like game is trying to create a save and it doesn't have a writing permissions ("read-only"). 

Are you playing on mac?
The solution is pretty simple find in google. This thread might help you - https://forums.rpgmakerweb.com/index.php?threads/error-read-only-game-crash.7049...

Oh thanks a lot for answering to this question DudeBrawGaming! It's been hectic few days and I didn't get a chance to reply here yet!

Thank you !   0: ~)

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Did this fix the problem?

Great game, good fun with interesting possibilities and story. Even if I got banned from the Discord for an innocent joke, I still love this game and it's fine community. :)

Ah that's too bad D: I must have missed that one. No hard feelings! And thanks for the praise. I can ask around how long the ban lasts. I think some community guidelines are good, because the game has attracted all kinds of people in the past, but joke is a joke, so yeah.

I was just teasing Kill Switch for disabling Hurting and said he was cheating ahah, but no hard feelings between anyone! Keep up the great work on the game and I hope to see you success with future content, etc. :D

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Hi orange,


Congrats on the release of Fear and Hunger. Wanted to give a quick bug report forr V1.0.3. After beating a particular enemy in the room (image) shown below, then attempting to enter the escape menu, the following "Failed to load: img/pictures/_1.png" error appears. Clicking retry will show a loading bar, which promptly returns you to this screen, making this a soft-lock. I've been able to replicate it a few times, so am confident in saying it is consistent between play-throughs. EDIT: on further investigation, it only occurs when the blood golem was summoned mid-fight; is it not being removed from the party at the end of the fight?

On a side-note, am loving the game, but found it very frustrating to complete the task needed to fight the particular enemy that appears in this room (being coy to avoid spoilers). As it is based on having certain party members with you, and I had a party of four prior to entering the area, I found myself having to clear out a party member to make room. This took over three hours purely because I had killed all but two very weak enemies (including the hydra), and had no circles for sacrificing another party member at that point. If possible could I suggest adding another way to remove a character from the party for cases where there's literally nothing left to cull them off with? Perhaps an item like a sacrificial knife, or even just something added to the above area/s, maybe pushing them into the center of this room? It would certainly fit with the area's theme after all!

Hoping to see the updates continue to roll out - really enjoying the narratives so far!

Hey yeah, I saw this on the RiskRim's channel. Really big thanks for finding the source of the bug. This crash has been popping up since the game testing, but I could never pinpoint the cause, because I couldn't replicate the bug myself. Also blood golem probably doesn't sound like the logical cause for this, so I understand that the testers didn't realize this connection. But it's painfully obvious now that you mentioned it. It indeed is the cause.

Hello :) Just downloaded the latest update and I wanted to know if there is some way to convert/transfer my gameplay/save file from a previous update to the latest one. btw I love the game so far. (I am CookieChan10 on twitter btw)

Just in case you were still needing an answer - if you had into the game files directory, inside the "www" folder you will see a "saves" folder. Just copy that and paste into the newer version's www folder. Be warned though, depending on what changed in the update you may find bugs occurring (e.g. saves from 1.0.2 played in 1.0.3 will cause the crow mauler to stop spawning outside of trying to save despite the "terrifying presence" messages appearing - although some people may actually prefer that!).

If you're having odd occurrences or crashes, you may want to consider starting a new game and/or deleting those saves. If you decide to report them, please remember to specify that you're using an older save file - this is considered a courtesy to game developers as it saves them from "chasing their own tail" trying to fix the problem ;) .

Anyone recommend a quick guide on the combat system? I find that I am unable to target specific body parts a lot of the time.

If you have a mouse cursor over the screen, it can interrupt the keyboard commands some times. 

Thanks for the reply. Really love the game! Cheers!

Question...
I understand why you made actual saves that you can return to be rare and hard to find, but is there any reason you couldn't make some kind of facility for a save and leave, so you can stop the game and come back to it (just not over and over like a real save)?  
Real life does beckon...

Also, could I please proofread your text for you?  It's just little things that should be really easy to fix...  :)

Well basically I just wanted to prevent save-scumming in the game. That's why saving is so difficult in the game. With an auto-save system people could just quit the game the second they think things take a wrong turn and then continue with the auto-save. Games like Dark Souls give you a penalty if you quit the game suddenly without going through the menu, but frankly I don't know how to make a proper system like that :P

Another big reason was to encourage starting the game over rather than trying to get everything in one run. And finally, save books are heaven's gift now in the game. Everybody wants them and I think it's a nice rush when you see yourself getting one.

I tried to make the game so that you can still play it through in bite-sized portions if you know what you are doing. Still I understand the frustration, because I play games in short intervals too because of real life stuff.


And yeah, proofreading sounds good! I already got some testers notifying me on typos, but if you find any please let me know! English is not my native language so there are surely a lot of mistakes here and there. If you use Discord, I think that would be the best place for that.

Not sure how to indicate which exact location some of the typos appear in - but a couple of little typos I see repeated already - "muckus" should be "mucus", if what you are trying to describe is something like snot; and the word "ominous" (which is the correct spelling) appears as "omnious" (incorrect) in several places.   Your english is much better than many games I've seen, especially with the large amount of text you have included!

If you could figure out a way to make a "close and save" which only worked one time and dropped you exactly where you left, that would be helpful, without giving any advantage.   Or even a reliable "pause" function.  :)

I keep getting severely injured, then having amazing luck - which is so funny.  Like being near death and just taking one swing at the shakespeare and killing it in one!  but then I have to go back to the last save anyway to get my companion back...  lol

If you ever make a game where you decided to incorporate voice actors, I make audio dramas for my podcast and know many actors who would jump on a chance, just for the fun of it (for free). ;)

Hey Julie, sorry for the late answer! Things have been hectic lately. I just moved to a new apartment.

I'll try to fix those typos in upcoming updates for sure! I really thought Muckus and Omnious were the correct way to write those words :D It's good that this comes up now!

Those near death situations are always really epic! I love hearing stories like that, because those are exactly the kind of situations I tried to build in in the game.

And I'll definitely keep you in mind if I need voice actors! Sounds pretty promising that you guys already have experience in something like that. I'm actually brainstorming and slowly starting a new project that has something to do with Fear & Hunger. This new project could possibly use voice acting if I wanted to step up the game.

had a crazy weeek myself.  If you need voices, reach me through my audio drama series 19 Nocturne Boulevard.  We would love to work with you!

Oh, and i got another friend hooked on your game - she also loved that your mythology, while falling into certain familiar lines, was very original and intriguing, as well as that some ends could be very nasty, which is more realistic than many games.

I can't get the game to run?  It shows I downloaded it, and installed it, and when I click launch it show the painting logo, then the start screen. 

I click on new game (can't continue. haven't played yet), and it shows the characters, and .... nothing.

Nothing I can click on, can't select (the mercenary has the box round it, but can't click on that character either), just nothing.  

Is this unusual?  Should I be waiting for it to do something?  I was watching RiskRim play and it looked really twisted, and I think he mentioned problems with older versions, but it seemed to run ok for him.

Help? Thanks!

--Julie

Hi Julie!

This sounds pretty bad if it really is the case! :O The mouse support of the game is really limited and clicking things doesn't get you far. The game is meant to be played on either keyboard or a controller. Did you try the keyboard at all? Diagonal keys are used to navigate menus and the character, ENTER  key is used to choose things and investigate, ESC brings up the menu and works as a cancel key and SHIFT is used for additional things like running, shooting with bow and arrow and backstab skill. Sorry that there isn't proper instructions in the game.

If the keyboard keys don't work either, then it's definitely a bug of sorts which I haven't heard about before. 

I am such a newb, I didn't see anything on the screen saying keyboard, and wouldn't necessarily know to check.  

How silly of me!

I think it's because the mouse got me from the opening screen to the second one, I assumed it should continue to work.  Sorry about that.

Haha, yeah I can understand that and it does make sense. Well I'm just glad it wasn't huge game breaking bug after all :D

Ok, now I'm having a ton of fun, once that got sorted.  Spent ages crawling around with a broken back, but somehow still fighting and avoiding things.  LOL 

This game is truly one of a kind. I even harassed a friend into buying it because it felt wrong keeping all of the agony this game has to offer to myself.

I've currently only got Ending E (the last/worst ending?) but I have 2 in progress saves running where I've slowly picked up on more and more. Hope that there will still be more from you!

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Hey thanks for all the praise and harassing your friends too! The ending E really is the easiest ending to achieve and sounds like you got plenty to explore still.

And yeah I'm already making additional content to the game that will come available in future updates along with bug fixes. Also there might be something else coming too further down the line...

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Hey! Just stumbled blindly into an ending (Ending D ) and I am... Confused, but I also wanted to say how much Im enjoying the game. I'm glad it's still super brutal and I'll have to do a new fan art too. = v =b

I encountered a little bug in the temple place that leads to Francois -- if you use the cube to change the time after you go through the door the nameless fellow is blocking, you're warped outside the map for some reason.

Also I can't figure out what to do with the scrolls, I've tried writing the "O LORD" things on them but nothing seems to happen, am I on the wrong track?

Lovely game 5 chopped cocks out of 5.

Hey thanks for the feedback! Great you're liking the game and I'll definitely look forward to fan art! :D If you got Ending D, it sounds like you still have new areas to find. Endings A and B require you to delve even deeper......

That bug is really weird, because it came up during the bug testing too, but I was never able to replicate the bug and that's why I never really understood what causes it. Does this happen no matter where you are on that map, or just in some specific spot?

Scrolls can be kinda tricky. You are definitely on the right tracks. The first line is always "O LORD", but second and third line make things happen. Maybe you've seen some books mentioning such passages in the game?

Great game, do you plan to release it on steam some day?

Yeah I got plans to release it there too! The process just is quite a lot more complicated than I expected :O

Is there an estamated time we can expect it on Steam? And might it be censored if so?

Currently Steam is reviewing the game build and checking out whether the content meets Steam-standards. I'm hoping that I don't need to censor anything. Graphic stuff in the game is mostly simple 2D after all, so hopefully it won't be THAT judged.... After the reviewing is done, it will take from 2 weeks to 1 month if I understand the process correctly. Sadly there's no way around this, but good news is that I'm working on more content during this down-time and the game will be that much more content rich by the Steam release.

Became a literal fuck nugget at the first 5 minutes. 

10/10

It happens...

deal with it

I'm using version 5.1 on my Mac, and I'm unable to save my process in this game.

Hey! So there is no "free save function" in this game! You actually need to find or make an item that allows you to save! Come join the discord if you have any questions!

Thank you!

That does definitely sound like a bug. I'll look into it. Do you have any experience with other RPG Maker games by any chance? Sounds like an in-engine bug....

Yeah as kill_switch said, the save spots are pretty scarce... Or did you have trouble saving even with the save spots?

Thanks! I'm new to this game.

I just tried out the save station at the bed on Level 3-Basement, but it didn't allow me to save on any files. Is this supposed to happen? Still using version 5.1 Mac.

Hey! So the that has a special function, it gives you a coin flip as a chance to save, if your sucessful you save your progress, if not.....well an unpleasant surprise shows up.

I got the correct face of the coin when doing the coin flip, which led me to the save screen. I wasn't able to save on any of those files.

Could be a bug! I usually press space to save but I avoid the basement bed. So there could be a potential bug there.

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The game seems very taxing on memory even though it seems simple? Are you using a lot of parallel processes? What kind are they and why are they always running? Anyway, I do really enjoy this very dark setting. Sorry about all the questions I'm just very curious.

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Hi! Yeah there are tons of parallel processes running in the game. Biggest processes are most likely the ones that check the character status all the time, like if the character loses a limb, changes weapons or puts on a disguise. Those processes change character graphics accordingly. Then there are of course the fear and hunger systems that keep track how hungry and fearful each character is and how those stats increase/decrease over time with all the status ailments that come with them. Then there are bow and arrow check and bear trap check that calculate X and Y coordinates of both the player character and enemies...

That's just to name few, there are plenty more smaller processes running for whatever purposes. Currently there are like 200 common events in the game and every battle has 20 pages worth of events going on. There most likely would have been a more optimized way to implement many of the systems, but to be honest, I'm not a coder at all :D This is actually my first real game ever that I'm making here and I'm learning things as I go.

I did notice that the hallucination system seemed taxing to my laptop and by removing them, the game started running more smoothly. Hopefully it's the same for other people too with the next upcoming version.

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Thank you for taking the time to tell me what's going on.

Maybe a lot of these could run inside the SAME parallel process instead of separate ones but you've probably already done that whenever possible. I wonder if the rogue-like aspects do constant checks too because if so, maybe stuff like that could be randomly generated BEFORE even starting the game unless it does that already. I know whatever I say is going to sound like  unsolicited advice because I can't really see it all in front of me.

I'm surprised combat has so much going on because it doesn't SEEM that complicated, not to undervalue the tons of work that went into it and everything else.  Wish I could see it more in depth what's going on but from what you've said it seems like that depth would take hours to dig through.

Reason I even comment is because I really enjoy this game and setting a lot which I said already. It's been rare to find the very darker themes and I'm surprised not more people are inspired by it.

Yeah I've tried combining some parallel processes, but some of them are so huge that the engine itself becomes laggy when making the game :D Most of the rogue-like aspects are set at the beginning of the game or on the spot when you get some randomized items for example. There aren't really any parallel processes that handle that stuff.

In combat, 8 pages already go to character graphics and status checkings. Because the game has to react to dismemberments and such. Those pages also check every turn if you are able to hold onto your weapons with less arms among other things. They are also pretty lengthy. I might be able to combine them, but then the pages would become like REALLY long. Part of the problem no doubt is, that everything is based on RPG Maker commands. There's very little actual coding. Also the game systems are a bit of a mess in certain places, because when I first started making the game, I wasn't quite aware of how much the game would actually expand in the future. The game is pretty simple at face value, but there's tons of detail and some odd skills here and there that affect the big picture, resulting kinda complex game imo. At least as far as typical RPG maker games are concerned.

But thanks! It's always nice to hear people appreciate the game!

I can't seem to play your recent build on my Mac, says nothing on my computer can support the exe

What do you mean? Is the file accidentally an exe-file? If so, I'll fix it for sure, in the meantime you can download the game from Gamejolt or something.

I still wouldn't challenge the beheaded wizard myself, but there will be some conclusion to that fight too later on for sure.

It's been awhile since I played the game. Would like to know if certain enemies are actually killable now. Like that wizard that summons a huge monster. Great job on such an awesome game. 

No that one particular enemy is intended to be impossible to kill, the only way to survive is run. keep running until the end.

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@younis, Hey! Thanks for letting me know of the bugs! Some of these were new ones too. I've been busy fixing them so that the game would be more polished.

You are very right about the dark priest and you are pretty observant with your other remarks too! The goal of the dark priest is not to save Le'garde, as you said, but the storylines are not yet complete and that is why all the characters share the same goal in the demo version. I'll work on it in the future releases and there will be proper endings in the next version. One where the dark priest will have his way too.

Interesting finds with the lore of the game too. The new gods are indeed those as you mentioned, but the lore will have some tweaks where the titles of the gods will change a bit. Their names will remain the same though.

And maybe you just gotta look for those empty scrolls and quills ;D

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Hey you're very welcome at any time. and thank you for replying I'm still playing the game to find diffrent secrets and lore and I'm wating 

patiently for the complete game. Hope you all the best for completing the game and  not have any diffculty with the anything while you work .I will not hold you anymore I'll report any bugs I find and hopefully I won't to not trouble you anymore

best wishes

I also think I've found use for the emty scrolls from reading the sheets that says "O LORD TEACH HURTING" I think  if you can find a quill and an empty scroll you can write something similer or maybe write something like "O LORD TEACH/GIVE ENLIGHTENMENT" maybe that can save the game? I haven't found a quill and scroll in the same gameplay even after searching all the boxes and barrels and bookshelfs. I've explored every location in game i've opened every colapsed road I had met the all of the mian characters and known about thier pasts and i wanted to ask one question is the door with crow insignia openable? or is it unopenable? . I'm asking this question becasue I've killed the crow mauler and I can't do any thing with him. He doesn't have anything on Him  when I search him and thier is no piont in skinning him either.

I've also found a bundel of information & knowledge   about the new gods and the mian characters hears what I've found :-

1-The new Gods name are 

Franois- the eyes of the blind

Nilvan- The mother of the pure

Valteil- The scholar of arts

Chambara- The tormented one

and there was a fifth one that didn't share the same greatness as the rest of the party               "The Forgotten one"

2-The name of mian characters

Enika- The dark preist

D'arce- The knight

Cahara-The mercenery

Ragnvaldr-The outlander

Hello and as always many greeting. I've completed Fear & Hunger as a dark preist but sadly i've failed my mission for resucing L'garde. I wanted to ask cuple of questions first being that the dark preist never wanted to rescue L'garde, he wanted to become one of the gods. But when i found L'garde dead text box said the looks like L'garde has been dead for a whial. You have failed you mission in rescuing him there is littel reason to stay in the dungen and then I retracked my path out of the dungen and escaped and i got {Ending A Escape} 

Hello and many greetings developer. I just finshed playing fear and hunger as a dark priest. I hadn't finshed all of the game yet but I've ran into many problems one of thos problem being lag but I don't mind it much. second of thos problem being that when I decide to show love to D'arce my character becomes invisible I can still play the game this does not happen at the first ritchul circul but at the one close to the beating heart thing you know the one close by the book that takes you to the tower of torment every time I've tried it happens . third problem I ran into is the bairols near the place  that you have D'arce join your party they disappear after I search them . the fourth thing is the the man that is chained to a wall at the tower of torment  every time I try to attack it I die with no reason but I I don't know if this a bug or a nor merl thing . the last things is  I read in a book that's blacks makes tssiues grow but it"/ doesn't  do it my preist's arm is missing and it won't grow back . forgive me if I annoye you after I managed to kill the crow monster nothing happened their is noting to search no point in skinning him the door that have an insgna won't open and two last I wanted to comment one of them is The out lander how did he get to the deep parts of the tree dungen with out leaving a trace  of entry and the girl D'arce she wouldn't offer her body to a stranger just because he asked her to I mean she a royle knight right?. 

Fear and Hunger is one of the most unique projects I have ever encountered.

I stumbled upon this game through one small YouTube letsplay channel (all thanks to Riskrim) and it was a very pleasant surprise. Playing demo 4 turned me into very enthusiastic fan - the amount and quality of work that was done already showed incredible effort and passion author was putting into his project. For me, this game stood out not just by merit of its solid well-crafted style or interesting and innovative game-design alone, but because of what incredible composition they formed, made to complement and enhance one another.

I want to go through every aspect that impessed me the most and that i consider an important part in what makes this game so great and unique.

I) Immersion and atmosphere

  • Main theme.

For me, as a main source of motivation to engage with the game serves its theme – exploration of brutality, wickedness and perversion and extends of their growth through the context of the game. On its own it is a great selling point – it sums up all of the game’s features without directly revealing them, so player would know what to expect from the game without spoiling any crucial parts and it sets to challenge developer’s dedication and creativity, by providing wealthy basis for development of story and atmosphere.

In order to realize full potential of its theme game needs to create a coherent structure of narrative, worldbuilding and atmosphere and correctly incorporate every element into a perfectly tuned composition.

  • Worldbuilding.

Worldbuilding takes burden of explaining players why they should immerse in happening events by providing realistic picture of the world around them, it is a foundation that should establish rules and principles all other elements use as reference to correctly coexist with each other without compromising consistency of whole structure. Fear and Hunger achieves to create coherent, believable picture of large living world, embedded with nuances and hidden meanings on top of generally well-written and creative lore. From the surface level, game follows traditional dark fantasy formula by portraying hopeless and oppressive world, devoid of light or salvation, where brutality and wickedness run rampart and unobstructed by concepts of order or justice. In such settings, gods’ design usually is mitigated to the only purpose of accommodating the atmosphere, while narrative is focusing on mortal beings and ways how their relations and interactions with one another shape the world into the horrible place it is. Commonly there gods portrayed simply as individuals with power, instead of higher beings that serve special grander purpose, emphasizing hostile and inhospitable nature of the world by removing concepts associated with civility and humanism.

What surprised me was to see how game stepped forward from this structure by adding more complexity and depth to its celestial aspect. Fear and Hunger reverses the situation by implementing element of deeper and grander meaning into gods’ characters – it provides each one of them with unique significant role and focuses on their general development and incorporation into the narrative.

Huge role in incorporating gods into narrative plays their presentation – well-paced and gradual reveal of information helps to naturally translate complexity of their characters to players. Aside from that, a different approach towards exposition regarding mortal beings and gods serves even bigger purpose – through the subtle distinction in the ways worldbuilding addresses them game gains ability to manipulate players’ attention and use it to direct their focus and change the perspective. It is seen, that when talking about humans and other lower sentient races game incorporates “show less, leave more for imagination” formula – information about existing civilizations is extremely scarce, but overall state of their moral and humanistic degradation is clear and obvious. On the other hand, game shares extensive amount of details about gods, presenting as much information as realistically possible – it shines light on their meanings, their possible motivations and the rich story they have with the world. However, it remains presenting complete picture vague, even in a rare occasion of direct contact, managing to keep their actual identities a mystery and therefore extending this sense on overall feeling of the game. That approach achieves to avoid driving players’ attention from superficial ideas, instead shifting their focus towards exploring the nature of celestial beings and darkness they cause, rather than on results of their actions, what I think is essential for this aspect of the game.

  • Atmosphere.

While the worldbuilding serves as a basis for all other immersion-oriented aspects, the way game presents immediate information is what is doing central work on establishing proper mood and atmosphere to the player. A great game uses as much of its components as it can for that goal – from the visual and audio design to gameplay and lore, if everything works in a coherent composition with each other and chooses a complex enough theme as its core, as a result may come out a true masterpiece. With Fear and Hunger it is pretty much the case – aside from worldbuilding, that was already described, game uses its graphics, its audio and most of its gameplay elements with great success.

The art perfectly conveys depressing alienated atmosphere of the game through bleak grey tones of surface world and dark nightmarish scenery of anxiety inducing dungeon levels, emphasizing on gore, brutality and body horror in most intense moments. It is very well done on technical part and from stylistic standpoint ideally suits game’s mood. Character design forms its own sort of realistic style, with emphasis on crudeness and detalization in models, which helps to stand out its impressive variety of monster designs, that revolve around themes of nudity, mutilation and other unpleasant motifs.

Sound design is something that I, personally, haven’t heard in a very long time – general quality is astonishing and amount of specific implementations will uphold most demanding standard. Usage of ambient sounds is exceptionally creative and worth noting – playing various tricks on player, game achieves to create very unnerving paranoid atmosphere, always making sure to not let him relax even for a second.

However, with all regards to visual and audio design, what makes this game truly unique is gameplay, as through its mechanics it makes biggest impact by setting up most subtle, most complex and most powerful atmosphere-building components.

II) Gameplay

1. Combat mechanic

  • Segment-targeting system

The central gameplay component is combat. At its core, it is a result of natural progression of traditional turn-based fighting mechanic – a segment-targeting system. In my opinion, that system should become a standard for many genres of modern games, from pure action-oriented products to stat-based rpgs. Even by default, this system is pretty complex – it creates a prioritization mechanic by bringing difference in segment attacking efficiency and it provides very deep development potential through allowing implementation of almost limitless variety of unique sub-mechanics. In addition, it also positively affects other related mechanics, such as inventory, looting, health-maintaining system and others. Game very successfully utilizes this system right now – every enemy has distinct fighting style, which requires devising a special strategy to deal with and only in rare occasions enemies’ characters will appear as a single entity and not as a set of mutually related elements each with own role and purpose. It perfectly manages to fulfill the role of main combat mechanic and as an atmosphere-building component it is utilized very effectively on many different layers.

  • Talking

Second main in-combat mechanic is talking – main character is able to try to engage in conversation with the foe with the cost of an action. Every enemy has its own set of questions with different outcomes. This is not a novelty in turn-based games, but it is another great mechanic that I want to see used more in similarly styled rpgs, because it is a very effective tool in setting atmosphere and world-building, especially in a game with emphasis on such things. Currently this system is in a very raw state – while it allows a relatively diverse variety of actions to execute (receive information from enemy, get a new party member, calm down/confuse enemy for a limited amount of time or completely pacify the situation), it lacks actual weight that would make outcomes of these questions more effective. With all the criticism, this system is working well as it is right now. It is a great tool that provides additional world-building information and helpful hints for curious players, while from player’s perspective, using it is very interesting and rewarding.  

  • Coin-toss

A significant importance in combat bears an element of random. In battle it is revolving around a coin toss “minigame” – a 50/50 winning chance luck test. Every enemy in the game, with a small exception, has its own special attack that charges during a battle and then applies itself after main action from the turn, initiating that minigame. It punishes player for failing by death and is implemented as a sort of parallel mechanic – it can be disabled by removing a corresponding limb from an enemy, but outside of that it stands separately from main combat system, ignoring important attributes such as strength, current health, ability to miss etc. From a grander perspective, it stops player’s skill from being the only factor that decides an outcome of a fight, representing chance and what may be player’s character could be interpreting as a chance because of their lack of understanding. The way it is applied in the game adds risk for player to lose everything even in an initially successful turn of events. In a result, this amps up tension inside and outside of combat immensely - it forces player to thoroughly think and consider before entering combat encounters, and puts colossal amount of weight on decision making during that combat.

  • Long-lasting consequences and player's treatment

From the outside perspective combat is utilized as an introductory tool and in continuous use as a primary mean of generating tension, being the main reason of player’s fear of interaction with the unknown.

The brutality and difficulty of the first combat establishes and promises to player what to expect from further game. It shows extreme hostility of the world he enters and teaches long-lasting consequences of engaging with danger. Firstly, realization of segment-targeting system on player’s character is made to accommodate that important principle of game’s design. In event of severe trauma characters lose their limbs, and logically - that event is very common in dungeons filled with terrible monsters. Loss of a limb is permanent (with small hints `of possibility to grow it back through alchemy mechanic, but for now it’s absent), as is its effect on gameplay, not mentioning a horror of seeing your character in decapitated state and realizing that it is unrevertable. Experiencing that first time was a powerful moment for me, thanks to the atmosphere I was immersed in process to associate with my character enough for the effect. I felt that range of emotions of a person that understands that he has lost something from his body and now has to live with it – a genuine panic, fear and existential horror.

Most important part in that plays presentation of game’s relation to the player, it is most prevalent here and runs through the rest of playing experience. What you can do to an enemy, how you can harm and mutilate them and how game indifferently treats that, in same way it is applied to player’s characters. That establishes not only game’s in general, but specifically its world’s relation to the player, building up feeling of alienation and hostility, signifying absence of any sort of empathy or special treatment. When your hand, head or leg cut off, interface’s only reaction is small prompt before immediate return to fighting, not even a reaction from a character – the way event presented as a commodity and its implications about world’s attitude towards you are powerful means of instilling uneasiness and tension.

2. Saving system

A person that didn’t play the game would wonder why death or dismemberment is such a big deal – just reload and replay fight until the perfect outcome. At this point comes central gameplay component that makes all others so effective – saving mechanic. In this game saving is implemented very interestingly: firstly, let’s talk about two different types of saving systems – in normal games and in rogue-likes.

The traditional system is known to all, it’s main goal is to accommodate long narrative-based process as a mean of going back after closing the game or game-ending event, such as failure or death. While its purpose is only to save progress for a player to be able to continue from last achieved point, it has created phenomena of abusing saving system and replaying dangerous encounters for perfect outcomes, supposedly not intended by developers. This is more relevant for turn-based or stat-based rpgs (i.e. savescumming in fallout), where the outcome is affected by random. This system’s main issue is that it ultimately fails to provide proper characterization and effect to specific situations and gameplay in general, by removing any stakes from risk-revolving aspects of the game and rendering them inconsequential.

The other system alters saving mechanic severely, building gameplay to revolve around it on several layers and lore to incorporate story and world in it. Instead of starting game over, death of a character treated as another step in continuous process of completion the game, with external progression implemented as most important component, usually through some ability/items unlocking or currency systems, for example you can take “Binding of Isaac” and “Enter the Gungeon” correspondingly. Since the point of that system is to accommodate cycle-oriented nature of the game, it gains means of implementing risk-revolving elements into the gameplay, but not to the extent of having them outside of cycles.

  • Progression

Fear and Hunger creates a hybrid of these two systems – firstly, it removes external progression completely – now death is absolute, there is nothing earned from dying except player’s experience. The in-session progression is focused more on consumables and some wearable inventory items – collected food and alcohol items are base resources for the fear and hunger management system, amount of healing items dictates your fighting capacity, various books open some range of abilities and actions and there is some variety of armor that gives damage reduction. There is no stat or level growth, winning in battle most of times gives you much less than it takes - currently there is only ONE sword in the game that deals drastically more damage that default one, and it’s not a reward for killing the strongest enemy. This always makes player to focus on an actual process thus making it more emotionally effective in result.

  • Specific saving implementation

Other, more important part is conventional absence of ability to save – there is no option in the menu, and, on a bigger scale, there is no game mechanic that is treated as supposed initial component of the game. There is an actual ability to save, but it’s made as more of a hidden mechanic then what actually expected to use as granted – it’s incorporated through a consumable item that gives a single-use ability to save and in addition moves character on next step of spiritual enlightenment. Both bonuses are given without any preliminary explanation and come up as a surprise for a player on first use, while second is not even completely clear in what it does after that. More importantly, reducing ability to save from being an initial important part of playing experience to being simply a reward – a small (but still significant) component in not a central part of the game, not only makes this reward extremely powerful, but also expresses that gameplay direction change to the player. Moreover, basing this system completely on a random emphasizes its inconsistent nature as a game mechanic, helping to solidify presented point in player’s mind.

What’s most important is how this influences playing experience – if any other horror game uses momentary scares based on sudden or subtle methods, Fear and Hunger manages to make whole experience a tension filled nightmare by making every encounter extremely dangerous and reworking saving system to the point of almost nonexistence. Game achieves to create a realism in gameplay from a psychological standpoint – it is truly horrifying to traverse dungeons knowing that there is nothing to stop you from losing everything, making smallest things gain tremendous effect, when even just a weird sound is enough to stop player in fear and tension. To generalize – a mechanical implementation of gameplay is built in rogue-like-oriented fashion, with heavy emphasis on random in larger parts of fighting, looting and saving mechanics, while from atmospheric and continuity standpoints game is focused on narrative progression and traditional treatment of main character’s story and role in the game. That exact composition of thoroughly built atmosphere and lore, enhanced by brutal and unforgiving gameplay is what I would describe as game’s identity. 

IV) Conclusion

This is a cut down version of my analysis of this game, due to character limit i had to remove all critique, so it may appear weirdly written in some places. For those who might be interested i will put full version in official discord channel. Aside from that, my goal was to express why i considered the game so amazing and try to covince people to check out game for themselves as well as motivate developer to keep doing great job. I wholeheartedly believe that this project has all of the chances to become a next big thing in indie community and i wish it good luck.

Played a bit of this on my channel! 

Hi! I played v5.1 today and found this bugged wall. I thought you might want to know that. Btw, do you have any tips for the coin flip coincidence game feature? At the beginning I had a lucky hand but then the game always used the opposite side of the coin I chose. And, when the Dark Priest fights against monsters he is scared of, does it mean his rate of hitting the monster is lower?

Hey! Killswitch here. We have a discord channel if you want to join. We already have a list of known bugs and issues.  If you need questions we'll answer them too! Helping you out with your questions...the coin toss is a 50/50 chance so you really dont  have a choice. Although there was a pattern in Demo 4, anway Demo 5 introduces phobias. Certain phobias make the character weaker, or as you say make the accuracy rate lower.

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For some reason, i cant hit the buff guys guys heads! So i end up dying in 2 seconds every playthrough. It might be a bug but if its meant to be in the game then why put the option to hit the head? Plz fix this :(

Hey! Hitting the head is instant kill, so of course it can't be that easy. In previous versions it was easier, but with v5 you have to first cut the legs of the guards to rock their balance. Then the head becomes vulnerable, with an icon indicating this. 


You are right that the game doesn't inform this properly to newcomers. I still need to figure out how to give players tips about this new weakness system. Sorry if it felt too unfair. I know the game can be a little bit more difficult at places because of this new system, I'm still looking for better balance. 

Have a dying survivor on th ground tell you some survival tips and some hints about rocking the balance of certain enemies. Or do a sparring seqeuence in the beginning of the game where you have each character spar with someone, (outlander and his tirbe chief/d'arce and the captain/mercenary and his bandit captain trainer/enki and his cult)

Yeah it's definitely a mechanic that needs to be explained.... Although in the upcoming version the chances of hitting the head are closer to the chances you had in the previous versions, before the weakness mechanic that is. So rocking the balance is just a guaranteed way to get that headshot, not the only way.

  1. Hay Mirohaver,  names Wallace so i've made a bunch of progress in the game but only because the Explosive Vial doesn't consume during battle, only for breaking crumbled walls.  So I can throw a bunch at the enemies in one turn. Almost all of the special enemies are defeated through this glitch. I guess it's a V5 glitch. 
  2. My friend had his one experience, Chopping off the prison guard arm and then avoiding the instant kill grab causes a loop where the monster will infinitely "take a step closer". Happened 4 times at level 1. He also found a way to boundary break in level 3, all the black areas are walkable. Clipping into areas he shouldn't be. 
  3. I hope this helps out, awesome game either way. 

Hey! You can call me just Miro :-D thanks for letting me know of the bugs and problems. The game is riddled with bugs at the moment. I'll try to put out more polished stuff later on. Again, thanks for the great feedback! 

Thanks Miro, I have one more question. I was watching my friend stream yesterday and noticed that the guard had a yellow symbol over it's had after a few turns of battle. Does it mean the chances of hitting the head are more in the players favor or straight up guaranteed?

Almost guaranteed. Most of the enemies got a weakness like that. 

What a good day to be alive...

I can't wait for more, to be totally honest. I love the game and I am a little saddened at the fact that I can't continue playing because I feel like I already found everything there is to find. There are so many secrets which I cannot figure out since only the demo version is available. What's it about the path of mahabre? What can you do with the embryo (artificially created by the black liquid and blood), what about the pinecone? There are many more questions which make me excited for the full game. I hope in the next update I can find this out and figure out how to make my party bigger by more useful characters like the Highlander or the Mercenary.

My experience: 1) I love playing as the Dark Priest because of his necromacy although it frustrates me just more when the revival of the corpses doesn't work out.

2) The crow guy is a tough guy. I remember when I had a full party of the Dark Priest, 2 ghouls and the little girl, and the crow bit all their heads off except for the priest.  I managed to kill it, but my party of 4 reduced itself to a one man army. 

3) All the different endings and ways you can die are shocking and exciting. It really makes the game special as well. There is so much detail to the game.

Please keep up the great work! Can't wait for the final result :)

Sounds like you've really experienced a lot of the content available!! I always love hearing about people's experiences with the game. Pretty epic victory over the Crow Mauler. Thanks a lot for the nice words!

i too am experiencing very bad movement lag,,

Hmm.. This sounds troublesome :-/ The game is heavier than your typical RPG Maker games, because there are tons of processes running all the time. That said, the game definitely needs some optimization work done. Hopefully I can find a solution to this.

hey love the game, but its extremely laggy for some reason. I was wondering if theres something you could do on your end. thank you for your time!

hey! What your platform is it? and how old is ur computer? [ not dev jus tryin to help ]

Hmmm. This is really unfortunate! I can try to look into optimizing some things, but I'm not sure if it's gonna help a lot in the end. My own laptop isn't very powerful and I don't experience any lag, so I wonder what kind of hardware you have?

Has some bugs such as certain terrain where you should be able to walk is blocked in the prison and tree dungeon.

Yes you're right. I'm trying to release a more polished version next time. There are a lot of minor bugs to be found. Thanks for letting me know! :-)

Also might want to balance out the game too when you get it polished. I do like difficult, but it might need balance with the chance system and combat.

Yo Microhaver! Have any idea how much more time until the demo version 5? I'm not putting pressure on you or anything, some of my buddies wants to know. Thanks!

Ah, sorry I can't give any real estimate. In a month or 2 I should be able to release a smaller update. 

Here is my gameplay part 1, of merceay, turn on subtitles cuz audio sort of died.

I find the lack of audio disturbing, but watched it anyway. I usually don't go for the head after hacking off enemie's limb with weapon - the fail chance is too high and you can get hit by enemy on the 2nd turn, i use kiting which i described in your comment section.

Other than that, keep going! You have to start somewhere)

lol my audio worker doesn't work, it records my mic, not my in-game sounds.

Adding another one was bakround ost

(+1)

WOOOOHOOOO!!!

HUGE SPOILER ALERT! DON'T READ BELOW UNLESS YOU REALLY WANT TO.


Ok, I will have one more run a little bit later, but, for now, I'd like to express my emotions and make a few statements. Miro, if you would decide to read the things below, please note - I do not doubt your competence as a game developer, these are my personal opinions and they may be completely ignored.

First of all, Marksmanship skill for Outlander. Nerf it. Enemy Instakills ruin the difficuilty too much. Make them move really slow instead, like they do when they fall for the bear trap in addition to losing one of their limbs.

Second of all, the crude sword that is dropped by lizards. Its ridiculous damage is unhindered by accuracy, so there is no reason to not use it as the main weapon (apart from losing one of the arms). Add a minor accuracy penalty to it. As for the claymore that is given to you by the Pocketcat, i have no issue with it because of the dangerous bargain invonlved, so there is no need to change it in  any way.

Third of all, I think this game needs a vendor of sort. The RNG here is just too goddamn unfair sometimes. I'd suggest the creation of an NPC on the 3'rd level (the prisons are too empty anyway) that can give you 1 needed item in exchange for 5 other. His item list excludes: opium powder (the trader near the altar of darkness sells it), cooked food, iron arrows (the trader near the altar sells it), books of any kind (we have Pocket Cat for that), whiskey (strong mind-restorative that is unfair to be given in such a way, ale is fine though), weapons of any kind, competent armor (trash armor is fine, but it must be allowed to be usable in trading), any kind of liquid that can be obtained by filling the glass vial (glass vials themselves should be allowed, though) and no explosive vials too.

Lastly, i'd like to talk about bosses. In the current version, they are too inclined to be DPS races - all you need to do is compile 4 party members and hack away at the torso. With a few exceptions, bosses here are too straightforward - hacking Salmonsnake's limbs off is not as reliable as an all-out attack on the torso (thanks to the overpowered crude sword), same for the cavemother, the head of the wizard is made only to give exposition and to be ran away from with no second encounter and the Crowmauler, oh the Crowmauler, was too disappointing for me.

Maybe that's my problem, but for a guy that is first introduced as this game's pyramidhead, he just didn't live up to my expectations: hacked off his arm and DPSed his torso till he fell. He should be causing the main character hysteria just by being in your sight, teleporting behind you if you ever start to outrun him like he was in the tattered note and, should one decide to face him in battle and not escaping on the first turn (that can easily fail), unleash myriad of debuffs coupled with weak AoE attack to give you slow and painfull death.

The solution for others? Make their torsos' defence much higher and decrease it for a certain percent for each limb hacked off.

For the Salmonsnake specifically - leave its limb attack spams as they are now, but introduce some sort of gimmick to give a player the ability to stop their actions without dismemberment. For example - now, destroying the eye seems to lower the accuracy of attacks for a bit, but it can be made a little bit more interesting - destroying the eye will actually make a battle harder, as opposed to saving, as in doing so you lose the ability to throw a red vial into it and to make it's limbs to do"tries to clean the eye" action for a few turns instead.

As for the Cavemother, the main issue that prevents the player from aproaching the battle carefully is "One Tooth Peck" (uh... sorry, can't remember the exact name) attack - instant limb loss is just too unfair. Make it use this attack only when its breasts are cut off - that way the player will be stimulated to act more strategically by having to pay attention to weak but tolerable cavegnomes.

Whew, that's a lot to read through. Despite the above, traversing the game was really fun. Can't wait to know more... What is the reason the new gods entered the dungeons of fear and hunger? Who is the God of Depth and is he in any way connected to the fifth member of the fellowship? Will Norasmus open up to us and tell what his role in this madness is? And finally, what is the purpose of the girl in this mess?

Man, i hate waiting) But, in the end, it will all be worth it...

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I have to totally agree with you on that one, most of your suggestions or as I like to call it "constructive critiscm", are mostly the ones I was gonna ask about.  All that lore and the backstory Miro put into the game does mean he/or she is passionate about this "project" but as he said before,  he has to deal with his real life situations before he/or she can get to this. Oh and one more thing to add on the table, maybe make the scrolls as a temporary save, or some sort of scroll where you sort of "embed" your memories in the scroll for the time being. I understand how the save oppurtunities are really rare and you have to sacrafice alot for even one slot. Maybe make that save option avalible for a certain time or something. And if you get the chance to add this on steam, give me a free copy ;D

Personally, I don't mind the current save system, as the acqurement of the Book of Enlightment allows to make the game easier if used strategically. For example, getting to Nosramus and using it there as soon as you arrive allows you to generate necronomicons, books of forgotten memories and even light blue potion vials for more convenience. 

Also, Kill_Switch-X, may i ask you a favour? Could you write here what your encounter with the book "Passage of Ma'Habre" was like if you ever encounter one? I used it once but i didn't manage to get a good grasp at the location due to the time limit and i have problems generating the book, even by using save-scumming. I really want to know whether it is randomly generated, whether battling spider-torso is worth it and if that place has a boss to beat.

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Sure, i first got the passage of Ma'Habre when I wa splaying as the Mercenary, thinking it was just the book Ma'Habere, I didn't think too much about it. When I realized it was a special book, I read it and I got transported to the Ancient City of Ma'Habere. The New Gods spoke to me about how I was gonna be chosen and stuff and i was on my way. I walked around and looted abunch of goodies from the urns and crates. Then I saw that creepy dead spider-person [I later was looking in local files and saw that apparently you can encounter a live one]. I didn't make it that far due to the time limit but I ended up looting those two chests, I did get it twice and just now when I'm playing too, well I usually always get it if I make the coin flip in one of the bookshelfs in the catacombs library, where I'm struggling to recruit the dark priest. Sometimes I belive pocketcat has it

I also fail to see why the human hydra is there, I guess its for the laughs

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Might be the same as the Altar of darkness - sacrificing party members to it gives nothing in return and praying to the God Of Depth gives no benefit either. Malevolent creatures don't really like to share, it seems. That makes me think - perhaps the Old Gods chose to be unresponsive to humans BECAUSE they stopped making actual requests to them and the new gods, while being presented as the heralds of salvation, provide no actual help at all as they have no wish to squander their newly acquired godly powers.


Also, thanks for the feedback, i'll make a mercenary and try to study the Ma'Habre's layout - I'll try to go deeper ignoring all the chests and barrels and see what it has to offer.

Yeah sure, free copies are on your way, if Steam was ever to accept this game, being full of awful awful stuff. ;D

You can get the book of enlightenment with the empty scrolls too. I wonder if anyone figured those out yet...?

nope i never knew lol now i need to see somehow

You can?

Is it

"O LORD

TEACH

ENLIGHTMENT"

invocation?

Nice. Close. There are only 2 invocations currently available in the demo: TEACH and GIVE.

Okay first of all, Fed, I'm really grateful for the time you've spent on the game and the interest you've shown. Reading through your texts has given me a lot to think about. 

People got every right to question my competence as a game developer (even if you said that you didn't) because I do a lot of things out of a whim and just for the sake of having some traditional game design breaking elements haha :D And also my game development is very reliant on the feedback I get from you guys. I just throw things together the best way I see fit, without that much game testing, and see what comes out of it. I'm sure every professional game developer would just shake their head if they saw me working on this :D

I'll take your points with Crude sword and Marksmanship and tweak those. As for the vendor - There's probably going to be an option at the beginning of the game where you get to choose an item or another goodie to start the game with. Kinda similar as in Dark Souls. This way the player can strategize a little bit more at the character select screen. Another vendor or something would be good too. You are right that the cells are a little bit too empty as they are now.

Finally, that's some really good insight about the bosses. I'm considering everything you said seriously. Especially the Crow Mauler. He was supposed to be more fleshed out, but I had to nerf some of my plans to get the demo out.

Thanks for taking your time with the writing ! :)

Well, I wouldn't be writing if i wasn't sure that the message would get to you)

Kinda ironic, really - there are a ton of people making bright, colorful games with good morals who turn out to be complete jerks to their audiences,  and the person whose creation is a vile, nihilistic and unforgiving experience turns out to be on the good side of spectrum. Life is too goddamn peculiar sometimes...

"Life is peculiar when your peculiar"

haha this is awesome! You guys made my day :-D

soooo um eventually i got the knight but i ran into a few problems immeditaley, first of all. The knight was still being attacked by a dead cave dweller, and when I thought it was bugged and left, the dead dweller on the ground somehow glided out of the map, and the frozen cave dweller on the right i had to fight again with its arm cut out, but it really iffed me because once i recruited the knight, i only had 8 hp left and when I died, the game was over, and no book of enlightment in that game session=perma-death/ another few hours of grinding.

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My, you are a master at sequence breaking). Personally, i had no problem with these guys - as soon as I aproached the right one ran away (might be due to me having girl and moonless in party), so i just bumped into the one who was attacking and did the battle. After that, the Knight was standing there in her idle animation and after i asked her about "what god do you believe in", the option to recruit  the party member appeared (i have to note here that i did pray to All-mer, her god of choice, 3 times before that encounter).

Also, i think you wanted to know where you can get light blue vials. The recipe appeared after i read Alchemilla vol. 2. Although Neco admitted before that vol. 2 is the same as vol.1, i did get 3 recepies other than given by the vol. 1 even though the text was the same. To create one you need 2 blue vials and it heals for 80 hp instead of blue vial's 20. If you haven't encountered the recipe for it in first-floor library, you might wanna check Nosramus - the guy that is protected by spectral knight. He has 2 boookshelves where you can potentially get Alchemilla vol. 2, or even the light blue potion itself on the potion shelf or by checking the pile of bottles near the locked chest. Beware though - the escape chance from spectral knight (both of them) is lower that usual, so kiting him (the one that is lying on the altar) is not reliable. However, the battle becomes pathetically easy if you use an explosive vial.

i found an easier way to get an light blue vial just a few hours ago, [and i beat the game too]. I decided to talk to some of the random mobs around the map, and I learned at least one interesting thing: Instead of fighting Tortur (can't remember name), talk to him first thing in battle and sell out the buckman that's hiding in it's cell, thne you get the key from him and a light blue vial, what a good deal.

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Nice job! Too bad i've never had any desire to negotiate with him.

DO you have any idea on how to recruit the dark priest?

I have a feeling that it has something to do with either cavemother's egg or creating a fetus (logically, i suggest praying to Gro-Goroth too). I'll try to do that a bit later.

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